Going out Staying in Judas's Blog

its such an interesting topic. Say i explained what i wanted you to do the task and you arrive back a week later and had completly missunderstood what , i was after
as a 3d artist its a thing i run up agaisnt all the time what you see in your imagination vs what i see

in a vr office enviroment is it easier or harder to say i dont really understand what im being asked to do can we discuss it some more?
Monitering makes it sound very big brother , maybe its supporting , or team work or somthing

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Weekly meetings are more so for a team to synchronize with what others are doing, and more specifically for managers to get an idea of progress of a much longer project. For some types of work though a more dynamic method of feedback is required.

When I did 3d artwork (a long time ago), I hated when people watched me, it made me too self-aware of what I was doing and I felt I had no freedom to experiment.

Development in general is an iterative process. It is not a process of doing everything right the first time. I mean, I feel like, people ought to consider getting feedback as soon and as often as possible, particularly if there is uncertainty as to what someone means in their request.

I would even argue that everything is a process of discovery, no one really knows what they want, and they need to see and experience many things before they start to understand. I would suspect if they had trouble describing their vision when making a request it is because they themselves don’t know exactly what that looks like, but they would ‘know it when they see it’.

But monitoring and getting feedback are two different things. Monitoring in a sense could help but I think what people would end up doing is, doing some work offline and then only when they are ready for feedback display work to be monitored. And/or, the person that is supposed to monitor will not really monitor at all unless you ask them for feedback on something.

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At least with the current job I have… I can’t really see any benefits that Slack or Skype don’t already bring to the table. Like, what is the upper advantage to have a vr office, where you have a virtual representation doing work as you do work? Is it offering the ability for your displays to be mirrored in the virtual office? If that’s the case, there’s software many corporations already use for that and don’t require having to virtually peak inside of Joe’s virtual cubicle.

Which is another thing to think about: virtual offices don’t have to confine themselves to the usual designs of physical ones, but would be easier to design due to familiarity. Would a virtual office of a large company simply mirror it’s own building, and if so, just give employees virtually the same things they already have, or would they go crazy and try to take advantage of the virtual in virtual reality?

Anyway, going back to the offerings of using such tools, say it’s just the vanilla Hifi we are all familiar with: How could a normal, corporate office that is looking to embrace newer technologies benefit from a virtual office space? How does it make it easier to answer phones, send notices or emails, find out why Lucy’s insurance policy has the wrong ID number? If the scope of the whole idea isn’t for the larger companies, then what is it for? Why would a programmer want to have excess baggage on their system when working on say a game or CPU intensive task? Would an artist honestly trade-off longer rendering times just so they can have a co-worker come into their virtual office for the latest gossip? How would a boss or manager get around learning to walk around a virtual hallway to keep an eye on things? Would they embrace the possibility of teleporting around? How would employees feel that at any moment, Mr or Ms. Manager can just spawn from nowhere and bring out their best Agent Smith impersonation?

On top of all of that… wasn’t this something Second Life pitched with education and other such services? I’m getting a bit of Deja Vu, and while Hifi does offer much better tools and customization, along with better audio management, it’s just hard to think on the benefits that are actually present and are in any company’s interest.

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In my experience, Slack is still lacking, and I am not entirely clear why, but it may be to do with latency in responses. I mean you can do a lot of things, like sharing screens and calling, but it takes time to do them and in my experience we only do those things in meetings and they are planned out ahead of time, not something you do willy-nilly in day to day communication, where as sitting next to someone, I can point at my screen and ask them simply “what is this”, or “why are you doing this here” and they can look at my screen and quickly understand what I am asking.

It also happens that when I type things out rather than saying them in words, I tend to edit what I say over and over to correct for mistakes and to simplify what I say to make sure the other person understands it simply.

That isn’t to say that any of that necessarily improves in VR.

So one thing I’ve thought about experimenting with but never had a chance to try since it is kind of a weird request, is to simply sit on an open call during a remote work session, and if I come across a need to communicate, simply talk instead of typing a message. There have been points I’ve come close to this before, when I was working with someone on a problem on the phone, but it isn’t an all day thing but rather just to work through something.

In terms of pitches, the market seems to favor environmentalism these days, and I think having a remote VR workforce would save a lot more in terms of GHG emissions than electric cars.

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April 2014
re posts my second blog post, to see whats changed in what, i want out of hifi
"Why am I here?

What is High Fidelity firstly it’s obviously named after the
kids from fame song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFSMLdmkdTM
that started me thinking.

Creativity and co-creation.

What used to be great about second life was creativity. I
used to go in there and build things and it was good.

I say used to because now it doesn’t work that way , all
that stuffs there still but times have changed building is now done outside in
3d programmes. I miss building socially with people stood around telling me I’m
doing it wrong.

What I told people around SL and was constantly ignored was
that I want Blender (a free open source
3D prog) to be inside Second life. It can’t be done, yaa boring, that’s not
my problem. I wanna…

HF needs to be a flexible space in which I can work and
play.

I know all you tek nerds programming Hf are using git hub to
share code. Can’t you do that in world? Have The Matrix up on the wall somewhere
drop the code in then you can stand
around sucking your teeth pointing at all the brackets and squiggly lines and
telling each other than you’re doing it wrong. Hell even run HF as a virtual machine
in HF.

Music.

Snooping through the
git hub there’s talk about midi support .For the non-music nerd it’s the way
electric pianos talk to each other.

I would like to be able to jam with some muso friends I have
over there in the States. Lag has always made this impossible in Skype and the
like it doesn’t work. If we’re not all hearing things at the same time as everyone
else music gets tricky. From my days messing around recording music using Cubase
delays of more than about 10ms makes it nigh on impossible to play and even
sing in tune.

So jamming with friends or even strangers is a thing I’d
like to do. Writing songs together would need a shared notepad that ties back
into the shared coding idea. Collaboratively writing an angsty ballad about how
girls don’t like me because I play video games etc.

Talking of High Fidelity I want all the chat to be at 24 bit
192 so I can jam with Neil Young on his Pono.

Art, well the same thing again. One of the most fun things I
did in SL was a Dr Sketchys party. Basically we would sit around and draw each
other using Photoshop or pens and paper then share the results in Flikr. I want
to do this with the drawing and sharing all in world.

Knocks on your door , are you staying in to play?"

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So
@philip
When will hifi be on the iphone?
I ventured outside the otherday and everone seems to be walking about hunched over these little black rectangles
After making enquiries they call them mobile phones
they seem popular

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Can’t see why not: Qt does allow compiling of iOS apps. Just you are at the mercy of the Apple Store’s acceptance, so testing isn’t exactly as easy as Android development.

Zombie land

Hifi is both dead and alive lately

The userbase is as large as it ever was

In that the people who always came still always come

The people who where here for the spectacle came and went.

The question that I don’t have an answer to is do the developers want us here?

They seem to be off touting the lofty ideal that remote working is the future

It maybe they certainly feel remote.

I showed great restraint on Facebook the other day

Hifi posted that

Now we sacked half our staff they get to stay home all day

But as a fairly regular user hifi were never very inclusive

They were more like the relative who only calls when they want something

But I’m equally aware of becoming the council tenant-I went to the toilet 3 weeks ago and the council still haven’t been around to flush it.meh

DO YOU WANT US HERE ?

It’s not that you’ve stayed too long
It’s not that you’ve done something wrong
It’s not your fault
But you embarrass yourself

Hand me down
It’s better when you’re not around
You feel good
And you look like you should
But you will never make us proud

So look at you with your worn out shoes
Living proof evolution’s through
We’re stuck with you
This revolution’s doomed

So the developers plan the future from their ivory tower

The users or customers as we’re more accurately described get the god treatment

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Both sides now

Was thinking about the new hifi

It feels to me like they have gone back into a closed alpha

I.e. they have a few selected teams of people we can assume bound by none disclosure trying stuff out.

What’s good about this approach is you have a group of people enthusiastically working with the tools and seeing what’s possible. Importantly these people aren’t focused on destroying each event that’s held trolling and griefing etc.

The regular users continue to live in a more open wild west situation, upsetting each other stealing content trying to bring down anything positive that anyone tries to build

This allows the dev’s to be aware of new developments in griefing and at the same time

Focus on the worthwhile parts of vr in a nurturing environment where you can build a community

Much like the Eloi and the Morlocks

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While I’m rooting for HiFi I’ve just about given up on them. Too many unfulfilled promises and little to no traction. I was suspicious of their model to begin with. It won’t be long until Gregarious Games comes along and James Halliday shows them how it’s really done. IMHO …

Hal

Who pays the bills
Im in the uk , its cold its raining most of the time, when im out of the house I turn the heat off
If im suddenly working from home, im heating my house all day and paying the electric to work from home.
Now my boss suddenly no longer needs to heat an office or rent an office
do you think he will pay my heating and electric bills?
He may argue that im saving all the money I would spend driving to and from work, which is true
but where I choose to live in relation to my job was allways my descision
I cold live right next to work if i wanted.
How has hifi adressed this change with its workers and their new found freedom?
Is Philip paying your heating and electric bills?
Or are you all paying them yourselves?
Now I know you all live in these bokeh filled magical castles over in Sanfransisco with hammocks and beeches cos i has seen them on the blog
Do you heat your homes there or does a positive can do attitude do it for you?

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And what happens if I break my leg at home during my remote working hours?
Who pays for the insurance?

And how is overtime handled?

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Christ, it’s like no one has ever worked from home before.

For all the heating and electric bills (and internet bills, since you need to connect somehow), most remote contracts state that any bills required for operation fall upon the worker. The idea is that you save money on fuel expenses in favor of just working from home (electric/heating). Some contracts do cover Internet charges, but only to their ‘minimal requirements’ and lets just say that is closer to dial up speeds at that point. If you do honestly live next to the building… well, tough, because you would be the absolute exception to that rule and may be able to argue that with contract agreements when signing for the ability to work remotely.

As for overtime… it’s handled like it would be in the office. Again, depends on the policy, but in my case, if I work an hour extra, I get that overtime pay. I check in and out with email to timestamp my arrival and departure (or in this case, sign in and sign out) and it is logged accordingly.

As for injuries… that one is tricky. As far as I’m aware, it’s sort of handled like if you were in the office, at least by procedure (having to make contacts before you log out to visit the ER or whatever, etc). As for if it can be claimed as an onsite injury… that one I don’t know. I’m curious, but my guess is that unless the injury occurred on company property, which one’s house does not constitute as such, it cannot be claimed as an on site injury and thus falls on the operator. You’d have to actually as someone who deals with that stuff and I’m equally curious with the results.

The approach High Fidelity is doing with remote work really isn’t any different than my current job, even back when I did work as a greeter, and the concept of working remotely isn’t exactly new either, so I’m actually baffled by why suddenly this is sounding like some new extreme thing.

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It’s a discussion.
The pros of remote working could be used line the bosses pockets at your expense
The hours commute time you get back does it become time for fitting in a few more emails and work calls. As it’s presented as a gift from the boss and it’s the least you can do
interestingly France has banned out of hours work emails

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Sansar to me is garbage for they’re killing off old users just to make people feel like they’re keeping up to real VR

As far i know in the past i did say hifi is made for mobile devices. And the did proof it again with some app. While mobile stuff is terrible to use. Gosh, explains why the ui is so dufficult.

Is hifi ever going to grow and get like secondlife or sansar ? Hard to say, not much hope, it feels dead.

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I think the better question is ‘can’ and ‘will’.

Can hifi ever going to grow and get like secondlife or sansar ?

Very much. A bit like Neos, all the tools are sort of already available, but unlike Neos, the amount of content is absent and the fact that servers cost money to operate. While in the past, one could just spin up their own domain server on their PC, it was so unstable that both the Oculus and Steam editions pulled the server out entirely.

I mean, look at the recent videos for the ‘business’ edition of Hifi: pretty much everything in it is nothing special. If anything, it’s just a reskinned community edition of Hifi, with different apps and just being a different world. I think what hurt Hifi in one respect was charging for preset worlds at a super high rate which was previously free. If people could spin up a quick server and throw in a world from the marketplace, it could have changed things a bit. This could beg the question if the island they’re using now will fall into this respect since business will just see it as a means to avoid having to hire an artist and meet minimal requirements for operation.

Overall, High Fidelity’s capabilities are top-notch and is very open for expansion.

Will hifi ever going to grow and get like secondlife or sansar ?

Honestly, this depends. The problem is that Hifi changed their scope and has pretty much left the community version they started on as just the ‘open source VR’ project. So all the features requested like shaders, voxel octree (though that was THEIR idea so…), and domain zones to name a few are now honestly on the community to create, and that community is small. VERY small. In comparison to other platforms, Hifi is a breadcrumb at a picnic.

As for the virtual workplace project, so far from what I’ve seen, no current company I can think of would be interested in what can be offered from the videos presented. I’m sorry, but all I’ve seen is IMVU with voice support… or just Second Life with Vivox. Considering we’re now going back to Mixamo styled avatars again (remember that phase?), anything unique or special is kind of gone. I know it’s early, but the app can only do so much right now, and you can only get so many combinations before it feels like you are dealing with a clone army.

So, why would a company not use the Virtual Workplace system? A few major points from the standpoint of my current company:

  1. What does this offer that Skype doesn’t? I know the blog posts have all pointed out a few things, but lets be real: what does it offer that Skype doesn’t? Virtual pressence? While a good point, a company is not going to care. You have to convince people who are used to just standard telephone conferences that a 3D model on a screen that somewhat looks like them that requires learning to play what is effectively a non-objective game to navigate is somehow an improvement.

    On a more serious note, things like improved audio quality don’t really work either since most things are about the bottom line and just enough to work. Not to mention, the cost is just cheaper as well to just use a phone. What could be offered is improved latency, which could be shown to reduce talking over eachother in error due to the telephone latency. That could actually be pushed as a good reason for the system, yet nothing has really demonstrated this.

  2. How does using a virtual workplace improve the workflow of a common job? How does Hifi make my job easier? In some respect, my job would be a Customer service representative with some administration work. How does being in a virtual world help me answer phones and relay important and sensitive information to another person on the other side of the country? Mind you, I work remotely and nothing Hifi has to offer would improve my job in the slightest except for maybe allowing me to move windows around in 3D space if I was in VR. As much as I love VR, I can’t imagine transcribing information with a flight recorder on my face for 40 hours a week.

    If we take a look at some of the most common jobs out there, according to a few sources:

  • Retail Salespersons: Uh… no. Nothing in High Fidelity can help this job.
  • Cashiers: Again, nothing.
  • Food preparation and serving workers: Nope.
  • Office clerks: This one depends, but honestly, most information or questions would be done via IM anyway, so not really. So far, this is the only one that ‘could’ have something but there are better alternatives.
  • Registered Nurses: Actually, yes! Online doctors are actually becoming a thing that helps screen out weaker cases that just require something simple so physical doctors can focus on cases that do require more attention. While a remote nurse is stretching things a bit, some information like varying scans could be viewed by multiple people at the same time in the same virtual workplace, and even point things out in realtime.
    I know this is technically for a nurse and not a doctor, but I’m sure that some similar use for when a nurse can’t come in for the day could provide assistance in monitoring something and still collect pay.
  • Customer service representatives: Not really. Even as a remote worker where this is the closest thing to a job description, having a constantly active voice channel where my avatar is most likely going to be in a virtual cubicle will not really do much more than what I already have now. In most cases, the idea is to get a customer’s problem resolved as quickly and accurately as possible, and while having the possibility of yelling at a worker to save something I was working on instead of IMing them where they can just ignore the IM, that’s the best I can think of and even then, the fact I work remotely means I don’t have to listen to the bantering going on around me. So why would I subject myself to the exact problems most call centers have for a more authentic experience when that experience sucks?
  • Waiters and waitresses: No. Not at all.
  • Laborers and freight, stock, and material movers: Maybe. In this one’s case, it’d be a like a giant radio system that all employees in the same area could be connected to so they can remain in constant conta- oh wait, that’s called a Radio and we all now have things called cellphones. Not to mention, the idea is to keep driver’s eyes on the road, so having anything visual isn’t helpful. Pass.
  • Administrative assistants: Yes! This is where I can see this working, where varying assistants can talk with eachother and their primary contacts. The problem is again that something has to be offered that makes Skype inferrior. Perhaps try demoing where conferences can be modulated in real time.
  • Janitors: To clean up this mess? Otherwise, no.

So the software is only partly usable by administration users, which is a very small market. Sure, we can talk about the sunshine and daisies about more independent companies, where the group is smaller and thus doesn’t really fall under the list above, but that’s an even SMALLER group at that!

Of course, it also begs the question: is the virtual workspace supposed to work as a background system? Back when I did greeter work, I was considered online when I was in the domain and in the proper avatar (later changes would then also require a unique account). When I do work with my current job, the login time is based on my sign-in email, whereas back as a greeter, it was via IM. This was just to timestamp the arrival more formally. In all these cases, some kind of software runs in the background, be it a VPN, a phone system, or High Fidelity itself. So that’s my question: Is High Fidelity supposed to be an active application like a phone system or a temporary like a video conference?

This is where the concern basically comes in: While the limited scope of the virtual workplace is more manageable, I don’t see where it can actually provide active improvements that would be adoptable. Not to mention, my current machine for work is a Dell PC from 2012 and that isn’t very uncommon to have older machines in active use in offices. Hifi would have to run pretty much on integrated graphics, and considering how much they kept pushing for the latest bleed edge stuff, that ship set sail by their own hand ages ago.

So… TLDR:

Will hifi ever going to grow and get like secondlife or sansar ?

Not unless a lot of crap changes or a miracle happens.

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There’s one big thing in high fidelity also wrong for a very long time, i forgot that.

The desktop UI is terrible, and not a complete system but different parts with different problems. Like the log, debug windows that have font problems. The tablet is never replaced in desktop fir something that works good for multitasking.

Try to build and then adjust voice. You lose you build states. The whole UI is one reason i dis say hifi is a fail. The sre still thinking app based.

Sansar have a bugger change to get in the market that hifi want. There’s no usefull reason to use hifi. At least i do not see anything that hifi is doing better.

I agree the did have a few good ideas in the days with zones and i think catching things in vr works bettyer with hifi. But the did throw it bathtube out of the window with the kids still in.

The main problem that hifi failed, the did keep aiming and mabye still do to much on VR. Also that people need to run there own servers did not help to, on top hifi is a but bandwidth hungry. That created problems to.

Am still curious how hifi is in 2 years.

Sundays Salon, everones telling us we’re wrong and still the community holds and attends events.
why?

Hope is difficult to kill, even with an heavy shovel…

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