Going out Staying in Judas's Blog


Very interesting…


Mutter grumble wah blah


Liked this a lot. What’s your opinion of how well HiFi understands this position/approach?


It seems to me the userbase for the current model rests at 15 people after 5 years
Even directly offering cash to log in we struggle to get 500 people
Conclusion we arent offering anything anyone wants or needs
The cries for basics have gone unanswered
people stopped asking
We were never told who hifi was aimed at
and what its for
other than its somthing vr headset somthing

it dosent work on the devices most people have
and the people with the gear to use it are gamers but its not a game
its not got a functionally usefull chat system
it dosent have an avatar system that gets anyone excited
its got a shitton of cool things that appeal to coders and builders
but they arent really end users
the codey buildy people have unity


Yes, I very much agree with this, and I’ve enjoyed reading these discussions with other community members on your blog. It feels like the devs are starting to get the message with the new offerings - contests, the zombie experience, that acting workshop thing, lectures and presentations, even the load tests are really just an excuse to have a little VR party on some level, and on some level it actually works - they are kind of fun in their own way. I’m actually surprised they haven’t just implemented some basic gaming elements that we see on other social VR platforms, it’s pretty obvious that many early adopters of VR are gamers. I always hoped they would turn stuff like mini golf, or longbow or even ping pong into something more sustainable. I used to hang out at the ping pong tables in Welcome just to try to look for a pick up game!

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I doubt that the 420 people who turned up for the load test where motivated by the money and the 420 was an achievement and does not deserve the conclusions you infer.
HiFi is a young platform and virtual spaces are unknown to most people and most of your remarks could equally apply to the www cica 2000 when most people didn’t have computers.

I live in England and all my life i have been involved in the arts creating museums and galleries and for the last eighteen years i have explored various VW spaces. My interest is not in creating some vw playground (much as i love literate Role Play) but in using virtual spaces for real world applications. But In all these eighteen years i have never met anyone (sic) who has even visited eg. SL and the responses to project propsals where blank stares and comments like “you’ve lost the plot”
I know you teach Judas and so great that you are encouraging a new generation of students but the issue is that among the ‘masses’ we are only at the beginning of discovering virtual spaces - hang on in there


So true, we’re even not hearing anything about fonts for weeks. :wink:

Maybe they see that only 15 people complain. :wink:

Is a chat system would be significant for the level of engagement?
I don’t think, but for sure people want it to make inter-domain calls. (I tried by shouting, it’s not working, they still don’t hear me on the other domain.)

Is good standard avatar provider would be significant.
Certainly, this would help for the retention. (Right now, it’s the opposite of that, most of people must flee because it’s so complicated to get our own avatar.)

Talking about what people need:(maybe there is other people needing that…)
I do need visibility zones to compartment my domain, I can’t run one machine for each installation I would like to publish.


Hundreds of users on the Hifi slack discord telegram including Philip
We can and do all talk here
Why log in to hifi?


OK I log in to HiFI now


So I guess I don’t need an avatar then.

If I’m limited by the complexity to express my being in virtual, Why log in to hifi?
I’m indeed better on discord.
That’s precisely what kept people on SL… the ability to BE in virtual with a relatively democratic way to do it.

( I do like this debat…it’s relaxing for the brain… it never open on anything. :wink: )


500 people show up for the avatar competition
5 entered
everone should be-able to customise an avatar
like in every other game ever

Were lucky the devs never read it :wink: they woudl be all kindsa mad at us


I have been logged in in spirit only lately, but yeah after 5 years would expect more than 15 users…

Why don’t social vr startups ever have any marketing? Just wondering who is wearing these business hats, if no one is its a race to the end of the VC then pop… Or maybe they will get bought by yahoo and put on ice…


This or say nothing and stop to dream. hum… Let me see… Ah, I chose this.


To invite people to not be able to have a customized avatar?
Do marketing now and get burn for sure. That’s what I think it might happen, but I can be wrong.


Hi Judas,

I’m sorry you are disappointed. After 5 years of hard labor. But I still think high fidelity has a lot to offer. What do you want it to be? Even when the tools are hard sometimes. It still offers the possibility to build your own world. For me as a mediocre modeller and scripter I can still express myself. High fidelity is the platform that, in theorie, could unite all the arts and has a promise in itself to completly transform society as we know it. I feel priveliged to be on that bandwagon. The loadtest events give me a glimps of what is to come. And if I compare the system with what it was two years ago big leaps have been made. ( stability scalability. Currency) I know we always want it faster but sometimes we have to be patient and enjoy the ride and hopefully meet interesting People.

Hope I cheered you up a little.


I also imagined trade would be something that happened in world.not on a website
That’s nuts
Shopping happens outside hifi
Chat happens outside hifi
Avatars happen outside hifi
And we wonder why nothing is happening in hifi


I want it to be a thriving and vibrant community
I want business to use it to end business trips
I want teaching and learning to happen in it
I want it to be simple to use
I want it to meet the needs of its users and not direct them out of world to other products


There’s still some work on high fidelity, avatars, user interface, setup your own domain. I think if people could get free domains without the hassle of messing with digital ocean or try to run it from home on weak connection could help to.

But high fidelity have many good things to.

More easy to build, because things work realtime. If you do something with scripts. You see the change directly. That make things so easy. Same for building. Realtime also give people more change todo fun things.

High fidelity is more aimed for htc vive or the support all headsets even. After reading blog today it confirms some other platform use main oculus. htc users are left a but behind.

I think high fidelity is doing good by not promote high fidelity to much like the do with sansar. You can better have a good platform first and then promote. Instead of promoting a bad and incomplete platform like sansar way to soon and. Problem is only that the not know there better things coming.


I hope highfidelity is convinced to focus on the desktop product. As a hardcore opensimulator fan,i would really like to switch to highfidelity, and i don’t want to use a VR headset (i ve tried them ,they are awful , they re only good for demoing your product for 10 minutes). I love building and scripting while chatting, making improptu fun stuff and enjoying the world. Highfidelity seems to have built a great modern backend, and should build a great modern world-building tool as well. I really hope they will focus on making it fun and easy for average users to build 3d stuff. I would go as far as saying they should create an entire mesh editor in the game.

I attribute a lot of the momentum and insistence on doing everything “the VR way” on misplaced hope to justify the expensive equipment that people bought. I hope your community will get over it soon and realize how fun it is to build virtual worlds without a headset.


I go crazy when I have to be in desktop mode for more than five minutes.
Not because it might still be lacking in UI design, but because I love being in VR :purple_heart: :sunglasses:
It just adds up so much to the immersion!
Plus many things designed for VR can so much better be worked on in VR.