Who all make custom avatars on commission?


#1

During the various conversations that were happening at The Spot after the monthly sardine-can event was over, I heard someone talking about the matter of custom avaters, and that some people might go to one or the other person who makes a custom avatar to your specifications for HiFi… and I got to wondering:

Just who all in our midst DOES routinely make custom avatars to order? I do remember one guy at one of the previous, weekly open meetings was talking about how he’d gotten his particular, distinctive, furry avatar made for him, but was lamenting about the fact that certain recent changes under the hood kept breaking his av and he had to go back and have it tweeked by the maker to fix his av so it would work again. (Hopefully THOSE sorts of inconveniences are over with. :smiley: Mind you, it sounded like the trouble was some uniquely complex feature of his particular avatar that kept getting broken in world.)

It would make sense if there was a list of go-to people for those who want a custom av made for them for the price of a budged videogame or the price of a DVD/bluray. Anything like that out there? I for one would love to have an approximation of my appearance on SL and the opensim, but made specially for HiFi, and with the ability to swap out between a couple different versions of my usual outfit (i.e. my distinctive atomic-orbits symbol on a blue t-shirt, and some thigh-length shorts for warm weather vistas, and a version with long-sleeve shirt and ankle-length pants for cold weather vistas, and maybe me in a blue speedo with the atomic-orbits symbol on THAT.) I’ve been patiently waiting for the day when one could quickly adjust a human-like avatar in a simple avatar-maker front end to look like one’s preferences (or plug in the slider details from one’s SL Appearances pane and have it convert THAT into the equivalent parameters for that HiFi avatar), and that there would be a standard clothes system for that avatar, but figured that might still be a year or two off. But, heck if I could get an avatar of my preferences made NOW, for $20 or $30, with the purported means of readily storing it such that it shows up for people as needed, from the HiFi cloud for cheap or free, or from my local Domain server folder. I’d be happy to go for it, and I figure there’s many others who would, too.


#2

20 dollars is 2 hours work at UK minimum wage
That’s floor sweeping money


#3

Same here, hard to find anyone to rake leaves in my yard for that price.


#4

Well, the price depends no how quick work (or not-quick-work) something like that would be. If its something that someone with the right 3D editing program could bash together in a half hour, because there’s some sort of “turn this set of reference photographs into a 3D morph” thing in it, could do, then it’d probably be fairly easy money… I doubt making a fairly simple av is $200 work, though. It’s probably somewhere between those two prices, however.

What all DOES it take to make a fairly mundane, not-very-complex av?

edit to add: One particular conversation I had heard part of, it kinda sounded like the guy who’d commissioned the av was saying it was inexpensive to get it done… but he didn’t really elaborate on the price. But then, I don’t really know what his image of “inexpensive” was, either. Heck, for all I know, to some people “inexpensive” = $5000. oO


#5

hmm… you are probably right. You should do it. You could make some easy $. After all, didn’t Philip say the av prizes they gave away had retail value of $450… or more?


#6

He was saying commissioning one of those 3D body scanner sessions was $450. That’s a different kettle of fish altogether.


#7

What I was trying to say was, you should try it. If you don’t want a scanned AV, pick one from one of the online services or make your own and then mod it the way you like. Then bring it into HiFi.

If it doesn’t look the way you want, change it and bring it in again, and again until you get it right.

Oh and if you find a good workflow where $30 is all it takes, sign me up.


#8

I don’t have the right software for that, or the experience. I had gotten the impression someone else did have a program like that that they were using, though. Something that had, say, a bunch of standardized furry shapes that could be easily tweaked and stretched to order so it had longer ears or wider eyes or something with a quick stroke of the mouse… but I guess that level of simplicity must still be in the highly experimental stages, or something. There DOES have to be something like that coming, for the VR world to advance beyond picking from a bunch of premade avs like we have now, but I guess I was naive to think it was already in the hands of some handful of lucky people today.


#9

I’m not sure if they’d be up for it, but let me explain the numbers behind my custom avatar.

in February 2017, I talked to Sylver about getting a custom avatar done, since I was anticipating being on High Fidelity a lot more. It was to be a remake of my Second Life avatar, but given more details. It was something I had discussed a few times, but knew their work load was rather high. After I had submitted my application to be a Greeter, I made the mention on the possible commission and started to get that moving. The agreed upon price was $500.

Roughly one week later, I was given a snapshot on current progress.

At the beginning of May, another update was given:

And at the end of the month:

From there, other work caught up so my commission was placed on hold. This is why for people who remember seeing me, I was using another avatar while doing greeting work.

On September 23, 2017, I was given the final update and the model files, per agreement.

The only catch was the original agreement also involved the rigging of the avatar, which was not done due to time constraints on other projects. Because I knew Sylver, I gave it a pass and talked to Athauxan about doing the rigging work along with blendshapes, since he also had done the same work on the Lyrekhet plushie most people knew me by. This cost was $100 at first and about another $200 over time. Granted, part of why I was more generous was due to his previous work helping out with my sim in Second Life, so this was also partly paying back for the stuff he had done there.

Overall, the entire avatar cost roughly $800, and was designed from the ground up for High Fidelity.

That being said, I have also seen plenty of other artists who are willing to do VR Chat avatars as well, and for the sake of having an idea on it, the average costs I’ve seen range from $200 to $400 for decent quality ones. Artists who would attempt to match the quality of my current avatar would cost about the same that I’ve paid already (~$800). I should note that the costs include at least rigging.

In addition, some artists I have talked to are willing to give rigging for High Fidelity a try, with one artist having already done this. The price might be bumped up since it requires them more time to figure it out. That being said, I have commissioned something with another artist and it was done in less than a month and cost only about $300.

To note, I only checked with furry artists on getting this work done, with the end product being a furry avatar. Results and prices may vary depending on the desired product and the style you are looking for. Also, if my one post is to remain true, I still feel that avatar kits will be High Fidelity’s initial bread and butter, in where you pick and choose the various components of your avatar and piece it all together with things from the marketplace.

I know it doesn’t directly answer the question (“Who all make custom avatars on commission?”) but hopefully it give some insight on how one commission did work out. If you do want to contact Sylver on the possibility of getting a commission, you can visit their artstation profile at: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/Jq04z


#10

athousand does great avatars check out fumbles
the mmd avatars can be converted in under 10 mins
https://www.deviantart.com/all-of-mmd/gallery/42695991/vocaloid-dl

if theres any u like there @Menithal has the tools to make them good in hifi
to build a custom avatar from scratch is a ton of work, most of these mmds are bits of different onces thrown together with a few texture tweaks
Im wary of making custom avatars because u can have lengthy discussions on what they want
u make it then they say can u do it more like this thing
by then the works done so no I cant
thinks flame got mates rates on that avatar


#11

Okay, that is definitely much more the sort of information I was wanting to see. And yes, yours being a far more complex, totally-from-scratch, furry avatar, the higher end price of $800 makes perfect sense, and the lower range of $200 to $400 makes sense for a fairly complex, original, non-human avatar. I suppose I could nerve myself up to pay $200 or something.

That said, I’d imagine that a regular-human avatar would be a lot less involving to make, since that would mostly be a matter of adjusting up or down the width, length, and muscleyness of the arms, legs, torso, etc from some already-made base figure that the avatar maker has on his machine while also adjusting sliders for things like whether the head is more oval shaped or pear shaped, more square-jawed or round-jawed, bigger or smaller eyes, etc… but I don’t know if someone has gotten that far wrt having made a base human figure to craft this from… other than I know that Humanoid (I think it was called) in Blender is basically this. It would be useful to know what someone who is proficient on Blender with stuff like Humanoid and is already experienced in making HiFI-specific avs from that would charge for his or her work. Would it be $200? Would it be $100? Would it get to the point of being $50 to $100 if all that needed to be done was spin some dials in Blender for half an hour to an hour, and to dial in a handful of adjustments to the shape of the head based on character headshots from the side and front? Or would that still be $100 to $200?

Bear in mind, in Blender I’ve never gotten very far past poking it with a stick here and there, and feeling in over my head, before wandering back over to Daz Studio (which is an offshoot of Poser), which mostly just uses already-made characters, objects, and materials. I have more than a years experience in DS, but it doesn’t MAKE new characters (other than spin the dial on morphs of various, purchased, stock ones) and the ones you do make are only licensed for you to use the resulting rendered images, you have to pay a bigger license on each of the individual things in it to be able to export the actual 3D characters into, say, a game, and I don’t think they ever intend to have something like HiFi avatars in mind for that 3D content licensing. oO


#12

No problem!

Again, referring back to what I said, I think the first successful High Fidelity avatar will not be specifically something custom generated, bur rather from custom generated parts. Using materials and possibly FST trickery, you could have a kit that has a set of various body shapes, broken down into their important components, various heads to choose from along with features such as eyelash length, and a set of hair to go along with it, perhaps with adaptable bones that go along with the kit to take advantage of flow.js. Clothing could then be made to observe the body types and match it accordingly, and maybe even include information to hide certain parts of the body to enhance rendering (mask via material?).

“The couples coming off the monorail can’t afford to have custom avatars made and don’t know how to write their own. They have to buy off-the-shelf avatars. One of the girls has a pretty nice one. It would be considered quite the fashion statement amount the K-Tel set. Looks like she has bought the Avatar Construction Set™ and put together her own, customized model out of miscellaneous parts. It might even look something like its owner. Her date doesn’t look half bad himself.” (Stephenson, 2003, p. 37, (Original work published 1992))

From there, it goes to describe the various customization that the kits offered, but I still feel the statement makes the point: Even if the avatar is generated in blender, imagine if you could walk into a domain and see a set of options to choose from and a screen update in real time as things are adjusted. The screen could be a blender preview being sent over at a low frame rate and perform updates when the user changes something. It’d be a major amount of scripting work, but this is just an early concept of a possible idea that could be done right now.

Some current things I could see being a hindrance would be easier texture changing on avatars without exposing too much. We can somewhat do this with materials, but if someone looks into their avatar entities, they’d have the files, KTX or otherwise. The other issue is how to prove that the ‘generated’ avatar was authentic. If I sold a kit on the marketplace… how would I pass along the credentials to say “Hey, this person purchased the kit and the avatar worn is from the authentic software”? The other issue is that most customization could be easily done if we had custom blendshapes.


#13

Pretty much my feeling, too. I’ve been waiting patiently for years for something like some sort of end-user easy-to-use avatar-adjuster package to show up here that was analogous to how old system-avatars on SL are and were handled… and I’m kind of surprised nothing like that has shown up YET. It could still be 6 months from now, or 2 years, for all I know.

I’d love to have an easily-customized, unique human shape of my OWN here sooner, rather than later. Thing is, since the soccer-mom-ready and joe-sixpack-ready easily-customize-your-av-from-standard-human-form quick-av-maker interface thingy hasn’t arrived on HiFi yet, and its unclear if we’ll EVER get one before The General Mass Public eventually show up in droves and someone out THERE makes one… I’ve started getting antsy and kinda want a basic, human av that’s unique to ME made in the NEAR term, not wait for one of those joe-six-pack-ready easy-bake av-maker programs to show up, hence why I was asking if there was someone who’s experienced in working with Blender’s Humanoid pluggin and with rigging for HiFi who could knock one together real quick based on some reference screenshots. My guess is, there could be an easy sorta-hobbyist way for someone like that to do one of these every now and then, sit down for a half hour to an hour every now and then, real quick, to make some pocket money… and if there was more than one of those types around, we could maintain a list of them for those who need it, until the mythical easy-bake av-maker program finally arrives.


#14

we are not getting easy avatars or text chat, but yay parabloic thing we all asked for , remember the endless threads and those late night discussionss where we all begged for that
woo parabolics


#15

Actually, we’ve GOT text chat. In fact, when you go to Help, it automatically inserts a made-specially-for-there text chat app to the available buttons, which exists alongside the other textchat app. True, the other text chat app doesn’t come pre-installed in Interface, but its a couple of mouseclicks away in HiFi Marketplace.

As for the parabolic teleport thingy… looks like that was a fairly easily made change to the existing select-a-spot-to-teleport-to laserbeam thingy. Apples and oranges here.


#16

Message me in the text chat and I’ll build u an avatar


#17

Pro tip: chat.js is installed with the client, and was to be included in default.js, but was commented out at the last minute until finally removed altogether. You can use it by looking under “system/chat.js” or just look up “chat” in the search bar in Running Scripts.


#18

Hifi useto have global chat but removed it due to it not being scalable
And it’s true it would struggle to cope with the regular user base of approaching 10 users


#19

If you mean a chat where someone types something in text chat on TheSpot and everyone on all HiFi domains everywhere sees it… well, that was kinda pointless. It makes sense for textchat where everyone on TheSpot sees what someone on TheSpot typed into chat, though. And that is what we have now. True, it would be nice if there was some way to direct-message someone live on HiFi and have a personal text-chat with them, but it doesn’t bother me all that much that we don’t have something like that right now. We’re getting way off topic for this thread, though. :smiley:


#20

After much thought, I think I can see how a very simple system could be done. Note, it will be using attachments because this will not work using avatar entities very well (though it could if a certain set of things got resolved).

Let’s start with a Brad kit. Brad comes in 3 skin colors, 4 body types ( Normal, Lean, Muscle, Heavy ), and maybe a few heights. From that, we’d also have different facial structures and eye colors.

From the different skin types, we’d have one index and the body types, another index. We’ll go ahead and state these indexes from 00 to 02 and 00 to 03 respectively. The same goes for the different facial structures and eyes, but with their own indexes.

Now lets say we want a tall, white, lean Brad with face 03 and blue eyes. We’d load up the tall skeleton, which has an invisible body to remain compliant with advanced collisions. We then attach the white lean body by addressing “brad_body_00_01.fst”, the face 03 with “brad_head_00_03.fst”, and finally the eyes with “brad_eyes_00_01.fst”. This would create our Brad with the desired visual results, all of which can be handled behind the scenes by a script dedicated to the Brad avatar customization kit.

So how do we do this without tearing our hair out of having many FBX files? FSTs can specify where the textures are, so when we have 00 index for white skin, we’d have our FST’s texture point towards the skin files for white skin. The rest of the file would remain the same and only be different for each type of part we want. This also means people who buy a Brad avatar kit and are in the presence of another Brad will not force people to download the same resources as the model files and texture files can all be shared.

If we were to use avatar entities, we could substitute changes in FSTs with the use of materials that bind to the individual parts or just adjust the texture data directly on the model’s information and use the same indexing trick. Clothing could then contain their own attached material to bind to the body to instruct it to hide components when not needed, either loaded via an embedded script or any other method. The only issue is that avatar entities are also shown in create and due to that, the information is also displayed publicly. This would include any material entities.

So, in theory, we already have the tools to make an avatar kit completely possible and be sold on the marketplace. The overall designing would be relatively easy as well, since the artist has to just focus on making a few baseline rules for themselves where weighting is the same between components, and could even allow others to make clothing for their own products without having to expose textures. The creator would have to think a bit ahead for features they’d want, like cloth physics via flow or possible third party modifications like different ears.